02-17-2026, 03:11 AM
(02-17-2026, 12:09 AM)DavidCroquet wrote:You have to remember when they say "truly democratic" they mean a totalitarian system with no democracy or rights or anything except duty towards obeying the state. This is their fundamental complaint about the West, that even in Socialist Yurop, it places too much emphasis on the individual being able to pursue their own ends rather than being the means for the whims of the self-chosen elite. It's why they spend so much time on arguing that "acktually, the West/liberalism/capitalism/etc. is the true totalitarian system" because if it's discredited then you are mandated to choose the alternative no matter what it is.(02-16-2026, 09:48 PM)Potato wrote: Modern "Western culture" is anchored in the concept of liberal democracy. Anyone who has travelled anywhere outside of "the west" knows how fragile that concept is and how quickly the world could revert to feudal dictatorships if western culture was to fall over.This is actually something that really grinds my gears personally. I do a lot of academic reading about education, and there's this constant refrain of "down with America, the US is a sinful bad country, nationalism should be abolished" combined with a heartfelt "the highest idea of education is to universally propogate truly democratic ideals".
These cunts...
Uh, fellas, how do you figure the western educational model got such a fundamental connection to the idea of spreading (and improving) democratic ideals in the first place?
The Left never has to square the circle about how the systems they support are worse because they get to claim they're arguing for a more perfect utopia, like Marcuse who argues that liberal democracy is a sham because it doesn't allow for true freedom. In Marcuse's framework, freedom only truly exists when you're allowed to literally do anything you want with no constraints of any kind, so if you want to masturbate in a park and then rape anyone who tries to stop you, that's fine because nobody should be trying to stop you anyway as that's violating your freedom, they're showing themselves to be fascists and fascists should be denied freedom. "I don't want other people living in my house" is violating the freedom of everyone else to use that house, or that land for anything other than a house, so you're a fascist. This is why China or the Soviets or whoever are closer to "true" freedom as whatever else they do they're abolishing fascist thinking that you own anything and have the right to exclude others. Instead everything is for the use of all, the people. The fact that "the people" seems limited to an elite caste is just the legacy of Western colonialism, the effect of continued capitalism in the globe, etc. Once we abolish all of this those problems will disappear.
So you're literally arguing against Heaven on Earth when you say you support Western culture.

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