Journal of Other Forum Analysis

[Gamegirl Nostalgia]

noodlesoup needs to start posting articles and pictures or else they are a LIAR

[Polident]

Will this be the third or fourth guy to light himself on fire?

[saltygeneraltso]

Erm, perhaps you chuds missed the live update from the warzone peaceful days vibe camp demonstration zone earlier today? Did you not see his post about radical centrist freak yik yakkers? All they're asking for is basic humanitarian aid in the form of views, replies and especially likes. Again, if you're not going to read his updates idk if the chapter can justify doing this for something bigger anymore, they're only freshmen after all, and it's almost summer break.

[Snoopy]

We came to a compromise where half of the group (SJP) will continue with their "legal" protests while (YDSA, the group that I am part of) will stage a sit-in outside the president's office in the hopes of escalation. There's a possibility of suspension (obviously) but we all knew the risks when we signed up. Our YDSA chapter believes that we need to take more militant action if we are to get *shit* done. I don't care if I have to withdrawal from all of my classes or if I get arrested. I'm doing this for something bigger than myself and some of these organizers just gotta realize that.

[Eric Cartman]

Whats the phrase the cool kids use? Don't threaten me with a good time?

[Eric Cartman]

I think it's very interesting how quickly men, even supposedly well meaning men, jump to conflating criticism with banning. Team Ninja games absolutely got heavy criticism 15 years ago. OtherM is a game so drooping with gross sexism that even a lot of chuds had a hard time defending it, for example, and that was 14 years ago. Sexualization was a huge part of that criticism.

Not saying Jeff is as such a bad person, not even a flat out sexist person, but he has heavy blindspots and is very dismissive of criticism from women when it concerns sexism. A lot of men are.

That anecdote on Nier really is apt to how it often goes.

yeah, fucking men assholes, equating criticism with banning.

Criticism is actually harrassment you stupid fucking men chuds

[Eric Cartman]

I just can't believe how pathetic they are about this game. 
There's not even anything sexist about the game, their only problem is that Eve wears skimpy clothing. The absolute horror. How will women ever recover? Anyway, time to watch Amounrath stick a camera up her butt live on twitch.

Again, its not even about this game, its about them not getting their demands capitulated to.

they're double super ultra pissed because almost nobody is falling for their bullshit, where theyd usually get at least an outrage farming clickbait piece from kotaku or polygon

[Eric Cartman]

Are Bluey adults the new Bronies?

[Eric Cartman]

https://www.resetera.com/threads/stellar-blade-review-thread.852417/page-21?post=122429574#post-122429574

Nah, I'm an American-born Iranian dual-national but I grew up in the Bay Area and actually my best friend for 15 years is Korean. I'll tell you what I tell him on probably a weekly basis:

We have the stupidest fucking governments.

Korea has plenty of globally popular cultural products. They don't need to add this one to their all-stars team.

"No, but I have a Korean friend."

I'd be a little offended if an Iranian implied that South Koreas and Iranians government are comparable

What, you don't remember the outcry a few months back when a woman in seoul was killed by the morality police for wearing her hanbok incorrectly?

[BIONIC]

https://www.resetera.com/threads/stellar-blade-review-thread.852417/page-21?post=122431365#post-122431365
Snormy

I'm going to say somethings on a few points I've seen in the past few pages. Aka Snormy mansplains and threadwhines so you don't have to and hopefully we might move along a bit better.

Just because a person is used to base a character off doesn't mean the character needs to be 100% accurate to the person. Just link in drawn art, you can use your own creative liberty to make changes if the project allows it. This shouldn't be interpreted as knock on the person which the character is based on no matter how the character turns out. Besides, a person has a million things going on including cosmetics, lighting, health, age and all the other humanely things that is more or less irrelevant to a model.

When it comes to feelings of representation... Just... Be considerate and know that you don't have to understand it to accept it. Sometimes feeling represented is a weird thing, it might not be because of the model, the voice, the ideas or characterizations or what not. It could be any number of things or just the fact that it is an attempt that has some semblance of success and puts your people in the limelight of recognition for the moment that you may feel proud of, disregarding of the other issues. Additionally, we might consider other representations in our media current. Name another playable Korean protagonist woman that isn't an optional choice in a game that is so marketed in the past decade. Slim pickings certainly given that just representation of women alone as a criteria isn't as strong as it could be.

It really isn't anybody's place to judge what others feel represents them based on your own understanding. Least of all if we don't even have any skin in said game. Koreans are not monolithic. Women are not monolithic. Obviously you can still critique a character that others feel represents them and you can offer some critique related to that. If you think such representation is poor or harmful etc. If you think others are a better example that is also fine but it isn't our place to shut people down for finding representation in our hobby. Just like it isn't my wife's job to tell your wife what she should feel about Eve. We can exchange ideas while we stay in our lanes.

Finally. Yes. Comparing Japan/ese and Korea/n can be insensitive. Many other such insensitive comparisons exist in our world. These are not to be dismissed nor should they be used to shut down conversations. It is all too common to engage into a topic we are not equipped to get into with the nuance it deserves. It is ok to acknowledge these and admit to blunders of insensitivity as an honest mistake. Comparisons are used to illustrate a point, we can try to find other examples or try to focus on the example without import or emphasis to their origins. Either way we're not getting into what is and isn't sensitive because this is largely personal and a derail. Again, focus on your points and not the side issues that crop up. You should acknowledge these and move on from them and not double down and be a dickhead. You can be 100% right in the results from your comparison and still be the biggest asshole in the room.

And yes. Try to remember that taking the opportunity to criticise a thing to simultaneously exercise some racism/bigotry is not uncommon. It is a bit of a systemic issue as well as some points can sometimes be dog whistling and mixed into the general discourse. Often times we get caught up in the discourse and can easily miss some bigger pictures, especially because they are often not relevant to us (we are not on the receiving end of it). If you want an example from the past we can look the example that is Genshin Impact. During its pre-release the world was very much all about how it is a knock-off China product of BoTW. You can find media pieces from the time that says just as much in various different words. Talking shit about products from China is a long running systemic dog whistling. It isn't not that there are no shit products or rip-off scams from China. It is that the immediate conclusion and association, the stereotyping etc that comes with it. Countries reverse engineer and take inspiration from successful things. China has also been a country of major global production, many items of excellent quality were produced to requirements in China. All countries have scammers and people trying to make a quick buck. There are many other things such as history or cultural issues or whatever else. The point is that everything the staff post says about difficulties in engaging on the topic of sexism is also true for things such as this. I'm not expecting everyone to see the issue right away and know how to navigate around it. I'm asking that when these issues happen, we acknowledge them and approach them with understanding and the sensibility it deserves. There are no easy solutions to these. It is takes diligence, patience, acknowledgement and engagement in good faith from all.

https://www.resetera.com/threads/stellar-blade-review-thread.852417/page-22?post=122433072#post-122433072

[USER=60638]genepark[/USER]
I just read your review, I haven't played the game but I've been forced to read a whole lot of stuff on the game to better moderate these threads. I don't envy your position as a writer because I can only imagine if you were too unpleasant or aggressive your piece in regards to criticism or some of the less pleasant topics in general it wouldn't get passed for publication. It is also important to recognise that many do not approach reviews for the deep dives into such problems. Too many are only interested in the gameplay aspects so if you were too heavy into the male gaze or culture side of things it might also not get many views either. I do appreciate what you do have in your review, especially links for us to go ahead and read further on issues in Korea. Fact is, if we're to talk about even a single culture and touch on it in gaming it is sort of a big topic and to give it the credit it deserves will make the review probably less review-y and more long form essay-y. But short of squeezing more into the piece I think having more links for additional reading is good. In terms of whether or not the piece should show your stance on the issues presented, generally speaking I'm find of writers trying to remain neutral and presenting information in their writing and letting readers form their own opinions but I also understand many do not prefer this style.

As I read your review and some of the links to other articles I'll say that it reminds me of when I tried to condense some of the issues and my own staff post into a new, concise staff post for the OT. Just trying to work out what to and not to include was a bit of a headache. The realisation that not everyone will agree with it doesn't takes the pressure off of trying to be perfect, but still doesn't make the job easier either. Even now I'm aware that some elements of the post aren't interpretted exactly as I intended but at the same time its out there and doing its thing. I can go and review the thing ad nauseum there comes it took some time away and for conversation to happen naturally with others before I found it easier to understand some of the reactions or feedback and not react back with "I can fix this!". I had some PMs where some users thought I was the best mod to approach and in my mind I was firing off this check list like; Not a woman. Not Korean. Haven't played the demo. Haven't streamed the demo. Not actually interested in the game. I can't always be or do what others want exactly and that is going to have to be fine. The disappointment and criticism is a bit of a downer sometimes but it is what it is. I'm not sure if any of this is really relevant to you but I thought I might share.

Feeling conflicted in regards to Stellar Blade has been the name of the game for a while now I think. Certainly some members have no interest and have written it off but a fair number also realise that the game offers something to them despite its problems. A conversation I had with another member a while back made me realise that I hadn't considered the perspective of women who really enjoyed the game but at the same time felt guilt in it due to the recognised problematic nature of the game. How expectation of others were that the criticism and acknowledgement of issues should also come with disinterest of or not supporting the game. It isn't really how it works though. Now again, I haven't considered the perspective of Korean representation too much. There are a lot of different feelings that are subject to the individual.

I just wanted to say, this is an excellent post. Some of the comments in here recently, specifically those directed towards Gene have made me feel a little uncomfortable. But this is a great response.

To be fair, there are a lot of... bad faith defenses and championing of Stellar Blade that deserves a lot of the heat it gets. The discourse is messy. Frustrations are abound. It is easy for any one of us to not give the other the benefit of the doubt and read things in the worst possible way. While frustrations with representation, reception and sexism issues are all valid sometimes we just end up getting upset with each other when we're also mostly on the same side of the issues. The back and forth with Gene and others is not too dissimilar to what I've observed from those talking about sexism earlier. A lot of members didn't recognise the sexism or might brush past it because it wasn't the intention/focus of their comment etc. In attempting to push back things can get aggressive or defensive. At the end of the day, we just want our issues with the subject to be heard and engaged in good faith.

Any ways. I'm out. If I never have a need to return to this thread I won't consider it a loss.

Someone should really get back on their meds.

[Besticus Maximus]

'bad faith defences' of a videogame

[HeavenIsAPlaceOnEarth]

Shift Up should announce that Eve is autistic. And trans.

[Daffy Duck]

I dunno, that character sounds like a stereotype of Autists.

Sounds like TwoHearts read the character bio in the division 2 before deciding on the protagonist for Era to be honest

[Besticus Maximus]

Two hearts has mentioned the division before

[Potato]

Erm, perhaps you chuds missed the live update from the warzone peaceful days vibe camp demonstration zone earlier today? Did you not see his post about radical centrist freak yik yakkers? All they're asking for is basic humanitarian aid in the form of views, replies and especially likes. Again, if you're not going to read his updates idk if the chapter can justify doing this for something bigger anymore, they're only freshmen after all, and it's almost summer break.

Quite frankly, if they don't keep the protests up over summer, they'll never free Palestine from the Nazis Jews

[Potato]

Whats the phrase the cool kids use? Don't threaten me with a good time?

I know, right? These clowns threatening to boycott universities in protest is actually achieving what the normal people have wanted for decades...all the extreme left cocks who make University life unbearably frustrating to just fuck off.

[HaughtyFrank]

Last post for tonight but the tensions were high among the group as we discussed the next best course of action. Basically, we're not setting up an encampment as originally planned. The leaders for this chapter seem too afraid in facing disciplinary action, which I can't blame them for since most of them are freshmen/new to organizing.

We came to a compromise where half of the group (SJP) will continue with their "legal" protests while (YDSA, the group that I am part of) will stage a sit-in outside the president's office in the hopes of escalation. There's a possibility of suspension (obviously) but we all knew the risks when we signed up. Our YDSA chapter believes that we need to take more militant action if we are to get *shit* done. I don't care if I have to withdrawal from all of my classes or if I get arrested. I'm doing this for something bigger than myself and some of these organizers just gotta realize that.

The leaders for this chapter seem too afraid in facing disciplinary action, which I can't blame them for since most of them are freshmen/new to organizing.

Wow. What an "allies" they are. Your future possibly on the line and you're unwilling to protest like the others? What solidarity. 

Our YDSA chapter believes that we need to take more militant action if we are to get *shit* done.

Non-violent militant action, right? 

Reminder. He's doing this because his university invests in Caterpillar who happen to sell bulldozers to Israel because Caterpillar sells bulldozers to fucking everyone

[HaughtyFrank]

We have the stupidest fucking governments

Iran is an malicious Theocracy that actively supports terrorist organizations. That is beyond “stupid silly government”.

"Oh man, your government doesn't adequately protect feminists from being fired and my government has a morality police that beats women to death when their hijab shows too much hair. We truly have the stupidest governments"

[Snoopy]

I bet that dude who set himself on fire is feeling pretty foolish now

[Potato]

I bet that dude who set himself on fire is feeling pretty foolish now

I'll tell you what he's NOT feeling...

Spoiler:  (click to show)(click to hide)

Anything at all. Because he's dead. Because he burned himself. To death.

[kaleidoscopium]

What the fuck...

Considering it has been established that a simple tweet can get someone permabanned this should have consequences or the entire rule system is fucking arbitrary.

https://www.resetera.com/threads/media-create-sales-week-36-2021-sep-06-sep-12-read-staff-post.487222/page-47?post=73871815#post-73871815

Funny how 3 years later nothing has changed on this front, hell id say it’s only gotten worse

[Daffy Duck]

I try to keep my beak out of politics, especially foreign politics (see the US) but are they hating Biden because he’s standing with Israel and in turn are posters on Era literally picking the side of a terrorist group?

[kaleidoscopium]

I try to keep my beak out of politics, especially foreign politics (see the US) but are they hating Biden because he’s standing with Israel and in turn are posters on Era literally picking the side of a terrorist group?

Yes, they see Israel’s self defense as “genocide”, so Biden siding with them is worse than supporting a terrorist group that committed the worst attack on Jews since the Holocaust. Bit insane but they aren’t thinking rationally

[killamajig]

"Why won't Biden support HAMAS?"

[Eric Cartman]

I feel like we need to re-evaluate the phrase "useful idiot", as it drastically underplays the weight of both words

[killamajig]

https://www.resetera.com/threads/police-cruiser-intentionally-blocks-off-path-to-save-hikers-bikers-from-fast-atv-resulting-in-atv-crash.861228/

Unanimous support for the cop on Era ?.?.?

[killamajig]

I know going to an Ivy League school doesn't automatically make you smarter. But now I'm wondering if it makes you dumber.

[HaughtyFrank]

I don't even care much about fighting games, but I just want to acknowledge how awesome it is, that Maximilian not only used his resources to commission this, but he commissioned it to a really cool person.

https://www.resetera.com/threads/a-modder-is-giving-marvel-vs-capcom-infinite-a-new-art-style.859641/post-122434740

Kind of a weird thing to say? 

Oh... the Modder is trans...

[Rendle]

User Banned (3 Days): dismissive commentary

https://www.resetera.com/threads/stellar-blade-review-thread.852417/page-21?post=122388636#post-122388636

You'll never believe who

[Polident]

I bet that dude who set himself on fire is feeling pretty foolish now

He’s got 72 virgins. What do you have? Yes, they’re they/them furries in their late 30s, but